Those recognising #autistim later in life, was there something that helped you realise?
I used to joke "I'm a bit autistic". My partner and I would note how I'm like Sheldon from Big Bang Theory, but I didn't take this seriously until..
First we broke up and I looked in depth at that relationship, how hard it was and why. That got me ready..
Then I watched #TheAccountant, it's a thriller but includes autistic characters inc the lead.
Boom! I saw my traits.
@actuallyautistic #ActuallyAutistic
I had an autistic friend ask me: "So, how long have you had your diagnose?" 
*spoiler* I haven't, though I do have an ADHD diagnose.
But... after talking to a bunch of autistic friends I felt pretty sure that I warranted the extra "u"
For me the big thing that helped was when I began reading accounts and stories told by autistics themselves. That's when all the info I had learned before that became much more immediate and real. Those accounts made me understand that my way of thinking and my sensory experiences were much like theirs.
@IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic Thanks Iza. I've started doing that after realising!
Although, only five accounts in, I'm not finding that much relevant to me even though the accounts are very interesting. I'm reading #DifferentNotLess" by #TempleGrandin.
Can you suggest anything else, particularly with some reference to #DemandAvoidance?
Were there particular traits for you, and if you don't mind 
I'm curious why you think it took you a long time to realise?
@doggle @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic
It sounds like you have similar traits to me, I'm a walking stereotype (not saying you are!) but I relate to Sheldon, The Accountant, etc.
I'm really pleased for you that you've found your Autistic Identity. Keep researching and it will all fall into place x
@autisticbookclub @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic Thanks. One of the difficulties, and maybe why it took me so long to take this seriously is that the spectrum is broad and every autistic is different, often quite different in significant ways from me.
A friend I told said, yes we say you're like Sheldon with feelings. Of course Sheldon has feelings. 
And I'm not that like The Accountant, but thought, I really need to look at this.
Then I read about #DemandAvoidance and it fell into place.
@doggle @autisticbookclub @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic #DemandAvoidance is such a painful but also super useful realization... I think it's the only part of my autism that tends to actively create trouble for me... the bane of my existence... but also still a significant part of my identity. I still rather have a society where we don't impose things on each other.
@lapingvino @doggle @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic #DemandAvoidance is interesting and you'll find very different opinions on this from the Autistic Community.
I agree with the the line of thought that says there isn't a #PDA (Pathological Demand Avoidance or Persistent Demand for Autonomy) subset of Autism, but that all Autistics have Demand Avoidance to differing degrees.
I think it is our overriding desire for Autonomy, which isn't pathological at all, but it does make life difficult.
@autisticbookclub @doggle @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic Thanks for that perspective! Yeah, PDA has been a UK specific term that can but doesn't have to be associated with autism, and it probably got the ball rolling for recognizing this part in many autistic people. I think many different NT perspectives work like that to get us further on figuring ourselves out. Some people complain about something they are annoyed about, give it a name and we get to work and reframe it into how it actually works for us, get a more correct explanation...
@lapingvino @autisticbookclub @doggle @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic
I had to look upthread as 'PDA' has always meant 'Public Display of Affection' to me.
@LunaDragofelis I had one of those, they were a lot of fun.
@LunaDragofelis @actuallyautistic @doggle @autisticbookclub @lapingvino @IzabelaKaramia
Yes, that too!
I had a Palm Pilot, then a Handspring, then a Palm Pre. Only the final one made phone calls.
@autisticbookclub @lapingvino @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic
I first heard of Pathological #DemandAvoidance and then someone said they preferred Persistent Demand for Autonomy.
I understand the aversion to 'pathological' but for me the issue is demand avoidance. I do demand autonomy too, but my avoidance is of demands.
That's what was so recognisable to me when I first heard the term and read about how it affected others. I immediately saw myself. #ActuallyAutistic
@doggle Same. It was such a relief just having a name for it.
@autisticbookclub @lapingvino @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic
In my own particular flavor of autism, I feel one of its central ingredients is rejection sensitivity which probably ties in with something like demand avoidance. That sensitivity was not helped any by how it can create vicious cycles of traumatic reinforcements. A lot of stuff got tangled up into a thorny knot and it was very difficult for me to seek help.
Plus with how descriptions of autism often pathologize autistics, it was scary. But learning about
neurodiversity and that while society makes my autistic life difficult, I'm also fortunate enough to have some gifts and I need to understand myself as a whole complex being to make use of those gifts.
Not sure if this will be useful to you, but it's up in front of my mind today because I just watched it this morning:
It's a 18 minute talk by Hannah Gadsby and how her life and thinking are fundamentally autistic.
@IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic Thanks, I'll make time to watch it this week.
@IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic oh, just read the first part of your reply...
Can you say any more about rejection sensitivity - is that your term or something recognised in autism? I've not heard it before but it sounds relevant - I find out hard to reach out even to trusted friends, I think because of that.
@doggle @IzabelaKaramia @actuallyautistic
Rejection sensitivity disphoria is indeed, a thing 
https://www.healthline.com/health/mental-health/rejection-sensitive-dysphoria#adhd-and-autism
@Zumbador @doggle @actuallyautistic
Always something to keep in mind when these kinds of issues and terminology are used is how the medical model still tends to pathologize autism and ADHD. That said, I find it impossible to understand myself without some sort of concept like rejection sensitivity and I know it has caused me a lot of trouble. Because of that, my doctor and I have been trying guanfacine as a medication because it does seem to have with the connections and signaling
@Zumbador @doggle @actuallyautistic
in areas of the prefrontal cortex that seem to be involved with processing things like stress, rejection, grief. I've been keeping a toot thread about my impressions of guanfacine's effects for me here:
https://writing.exchange/@IzabelaKaramia/109786099409754905
For a medical journal article about the prefrontal cortex and its involvement in executive function, I sometimes reread this article:
@doggle @actuallyautistic I got diagnosed with ADHD as the result of persistent mental health issues. After this I connected with various neurodiversity groups where I mixed with autistic people. I realised that I had more in common with them than the more typically ADHD people I knew. After that I started seeing evidence of my autism all over the place.
@doggle @actuallyautistic for me, Hanna Gadsby convinced me in princely autistic. Went and saw her live in Melbourne. There was a line in her show, Douglas, something like:
"Being autistic is like the whole world is drunk and you aren't, but you don't know they are all drunk."
Ooh, thank you Hanna, now my life makes sense.
@petherfile @actuallyautistic Thanks, I can relate to that too!
@doggle @actuallyautistic I know I am ND but not sure about autistic, BUT everyone in the community seems to keep me as their own therefore if they say you are then maybe... 
@doggle @actuallyautistic
Came across an autism test in my 50's and took it. The ridiculous high score got my self-diagnosis ball rolling and for me to finally come to accept. I spent along time reading blogs and watching videos of actual autistics. Seeing myself in them and learning about what autism and it's associated traits are. One warning I will give you. You will come across a saying, that if you have met one autistic you have met one autistic. This is beyond true. Many of the things you come across will not reflect your autism and be things you do not recognise in yourself. They do not invalidate you from being autistic, they just make you different
@doggle
I was on a refresher seminar for a therapy method I use in my office. There was a lady who had just been dxd. She said: “You mustn’t ask a high functioning autist what they can’t do, autism-specifically. Because they can do everything. You have to ask how much it costs them.”
Suddenly a whole lot of pieces fell into place.
I got officially dxd 8 months later.
@manon Thanks, this makes sense. It always puzzled me. I couldn't understand that things were so hard for me, ordinary things that didn't seem hard for others - but I just assumed they hid it too. Seems daft after the fact!
@doggle I had always wondered why others exerted themselves at lot less for me than vice versa. Until I realized they didn’t need to.
@sentient_water @doggle
Very much so.
And what’s more, the difficult things are sometimes easy and sometimes insurmountable. And I can’t foresee when they will be what.
I wrote my first ever article for a scientific workbook just fine. And then literally fell sick for two days because I wasn’t able to sort the names of the coauthors with the sparse information from my professor how he wanted them to be.
@manon @doggle You have no idea how much I relate to this. I wrote my first academic paper on autism in four hours. I then sent it to two Drs of psychology who said with only a few tiny changes it would be ready for publication in a peer reviewed psychology magazine.
I still haven't made those changes & I've graduated. It still infuriates me.
@sentient_water @doggle
I feel you.
The only thing that helps me is when I get so annoyed about myself that I kind of hurl myself over the barrier no matter what. I can’t be happy or content with myself afterwards, it’s just a grim „well, I did it at last“.
@manon @doggle Yeah 
much like The Accountant I need to finish. If that's in a timely fashion great. If not it's like an itch I can't scratch, for years sometimes.
I can't imagine how many opportunities I've missed in life because of it. I've heard it called Autistic Inertia & that really fits with how it feels to me.
@sentient_water
I‘ve heard this expression too. For me it doesn’t fit. I associate inertia with something big and heavy, while what keeps me from doing these oh-so-easy things is either turmoil in my head or a freeze or both. It’s interesting that you seem to experience a different quality there.
Do you think this itching after a lost opportunity is autism specific? Does our precise memory play tricks on us here?
@manon I don't think it's a different quality just a subjective expression. Freeze would work just as well. I use inertia because it also has a positive aspect. In that once I overcome it it's like a huge stone rolling down a hill & I can enter a flow state for a couple of years where I accomplish incredible things.
Also I mean actually miss opportunities. I miss deadlines for applications. Don't maintain contact with people.
@sentient_water Ok, I meant missed opportunities too, now that I read your reply. :)
This inertia thing producing kinetic energy for a couple of years sounds amazing!
I do my „amazing“ things in an uphill-downhill Mars Rover mode. Slow pacing, but stubborn and optimistically curious.
@manon Yeah it is thrilling but being inert for two years while I build up the momentum is tedious. I usually get things done in the background but still.
I think slow & steady wins the race but I guess we all have to approach life differently.
@sentient_water I‘m aware that „slow and steady wins the race“ is a phrase, but as you also indicate there is no race to win. It’s the way we approach our lives individually.
I will never ever „learn“ not to overburden myself. I always have too much on my plate and have a talent to magnetically attract tasks. 
@doggle It was when my oldest son was diagnosed AuDHD at 19, and said "have you ever considered why you never thought to have me tested? Like, that maybe nobody in this family is neurotypical?"
And then I started researching, and taking tests, and .... it all slammed home.
@doggle @actuallyautistic
I found out by accident. I took the online AQ test and scored really high. I then took several others and they said the same thing. I finally got diagnosed at age 58. I built a resource website to help other late diagnosed adults find the autistic community, books by autistics, podcasts, social media. etc. https://autism-101.com
@doggle @actuallyautistic Most of my life I've been compared to Mr. Spock (fairly accurately, I think). I've always known I'm rather abrupt and a bit "odd", but it never occurred to me that I'm autistic until my sister (who's a therapist) suggested it. Then when I started talking to autistic people here. . . suddenly so many things in my life made sense.
@doggle @actuallyautistic I always presumed my issues were related to #introversion and never ever suspected #Autism. It wasn’t until I spent a few years working with our #ActuallyAutistic son and read “ #Unmasking Autism” that I finally began to draw parallels in my life. And then I immediately moved to seek formal #DX.
I don’t have fixes for my challenges yet. But my awareness is at least helping put then in context.
I watched #TheAccountant last night thanks to this. Thanks for the tip. Would be funny to see a version where all the violence is edited out, so it is just a guy having fun with his mathematical special interest.
In terms of books, you might want to try "So you think you're autistic: A workbook for the confused person who's just trying to figure things out"* by Samantha Stein (aka Yo Samdy Sam**)
Video introduction at https://www.youtube.com/live/ojEWbNH0U_4?feature=share
* https://amzn.to/3ltZgXR (affiliate link)
@edaross
Thanks Ed, check it out.