Mastodon

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://birdbutt.com/@vulgalour" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">vulgalour</a> First of all, "image description" and "alt-text" don't mean the same thing. Alt-text is what's added directly to the image. It's what screen readers used by blind or visually-impaired people read out loud as they can't "read out loud" an image. It's what people see instead of the image if the image doesn't show for them (text-based client, too slow Internet connection, whatever). Alt-text should never convey more information than the image which it is a replacement for. An image description that goes into the post itself is not alt-text. I don't see any rule or part of the "Fediquette" or "Mastodon culture" that speaks against adding that additional information to a reply. Whether it works or not depends on whether your customers accept it or not. I guess that 99% of your aspiring customers in the Fediverse will be on Mastodon, only see your start post and not be bothered to check the replies. So my suggestion is to leave room in the original post for tellling your customers that prices can be found in a reply to that post. But seeing as this will happen to you a lot, it may be worth looking for someplace that offers you more than 500 characters: <ul><li>a Mastodon instance with a raised character limit</li><li>Pleroma (5,000 characters by default, configurable by the admin)</li><li>Akkoma (5,000 characters by default, configurable by the admin)</li><li>Misskey (3,000 characters, hard-coded; just steer clear of misskey.io)</li><li>the various forks of Misskey and forks of their forks like Iceshrimp or Sharkey (thousands of characters by default, configurable by the admin)</li></ul> If you need a five-digit character count, the best you can do requires basically re-learning the Fediverse, mastering a significantly steeper learning curve and very likely abandoning dedicated apps. Here we're talking about Mike Macgirvin's creations from Friendica (200,000 characters) to Hubzilla (probably even higher) to (streams) and Forte (over 24,000,000 characters). #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Fediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Fediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Pleroma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Pleroma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Akkoma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Akkoma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Misskey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Misskey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkeys" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkeys</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Iceshrimp" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Iceshrimp</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Sharkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Sharkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forte</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mstdn.party/@RepresentativeSample" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Representative Sample</a> Well, Mastodon's internal character limits, 500 characters for posts, 1,500 characters for alt-text, are both hard-coded in a file that is being synced by git. It can be changed, but only by modifying what's essentially the source code. Mastodon's current culture was established in 2022 by people who came in from Twitter in the first migration wave which started in February when Elon Musk announced his intention to take over Twitter. In this migration wave already, so many people came to Mastodon, especially mastodon.social, that it didn't take long for them to only encounter their own likes and hardly come across anyone who had been Mastodon users before 2022. Thus, they created a culture that was completely independent from pre-2022 Mastodon. Also, not a single one of them knew what the Fediverse really was. For absolutely all of them, the Fediverse was Mastodon and only Mastodon. Vanilla Mastodon with a hard 500-character limit which, in the light of only 280 characters on Twitter, already felt like a lot to them. They did not know about Misskey with 3,000 hard-coded characters. Or Pleroma and Akkoma with 5,000 configurable characters. Or the various Misskey forks with configurable limits of several thousands of characters. Nor did they know about Friendica, over five years older than Mastodon, or Hubzilla, a Friendica fork that's still almost four years older than Mastodon at its core. These two don't have any arbitrary character limits at all. And especially, they didn't know that all of these were fully, bidirectionally connected to Mastodon and interacting with Mastodon all the time. In fact, ever since, it has always taken Mastodon newbies quite a while to even learn about Mastodon instances with modified character limits, not to mention Mastodon forks with configurable character limits. And so it was those recent Twitter-to-Mastodon newbies who defined a whole new culture, based on vanilla Mastodon 3.x, its features and its limitations, but for the entire Fediverse. This culture was set in stone in late October already when the second migration wave started, and Mastodon newcomers who really settled into Mastodon, rather than wanting another Twitter, have been living this culture ever since. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Fediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Fediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Pleroma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Pleroma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Akkoma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Akkoma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Misskey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Misskey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkeys" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkeys</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://sueden.social/@Laberpferd" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Laberpferd</a> I do a combination of both. For my original images, I always start with a full, long, detailed, all-encompassing description that includes all necessary explanations and transcripts of all bits of text within the borders of the image. This description goes into the post. Hubzilla doesn't really have a character limit. AFAIK, Mastodon rejects posts with more than 100,000 characters, and I could exceed even that. So I've got lots of space for descriptions. I've pretty much discarded the idea of putting the long description into a separate document and linking to it. Then, to satisfy those who absolutely demand there be an image description in the alt-text, I make a separate, shorter description for the alt-text. Its length is always such that this description, plus a note that a longer and more informative description with explanations and text transcripts can be found in the post, hidden behind a content warning, ends up with exactly 1,500 characters or a little below. CC: @<a href="https://wandering.shop/@AlinaLeonova" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Alina Leonova</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescription" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescription</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptions" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptions</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWImageDescriptionMeta</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://tupambae.org/profile/utopiarte" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">utopiArte</a> I wasn't only posting this with raw technology in mind. I was also thinking about cultural differences that arose from the technological differences. Friendica and Hubzilla are technologically very different from Mastodon. Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) users are rather used to that. They try to cope with it the best they can, although this alone brings its own bunch of issues with itself. Mastodon users, on the other hand, are not used to it. Many of them have come to Mastodon from Twitter over the last two years, believing that Mastodon is only one Web site. And pretty much all of them, every last one of them, came to Mastodon, believing that the Fediverse that everyone talks about is Mastodon. And nothing else. Those who have invited them to Mastodon have not told them that Mastodon is connected to things that aren't Mastodon, much less that Mastodon is connected to things that are very much not Mastodon. Nearly all Twitter refugees on Mastodon have spent their first several months on Mastodon in this belief. They've settled into and gotten used to a Fediverse that's only Mastodon. Many, not all of them, but many have since found out that there are things in the Fediverse that are very different from Mastodon. For not exactly few, it was a disturbing, if not outright traumatising experience to see that some Fediverse users can post over 500 characters at once. Or that some Fediverse users can easily "quote-toot" Mastodon toots, using something which is used on 𝕏 to harass members of marginalised minorities. They didn't want that. They still don't want that. They want to make it go away again, so disturbing is it. By and by, at least some Mastodon users face other differences between Mastodon on the one side and things like Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) on the other side. For example, what the way these three handle conversations means in practice for users of Mastodon which doesn't have a concept of conversations. Or that Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) users do not react when someone on Mastodon mentions them out of the blue. Everyone on Mastodon would notice it, so it's beyond a Mastodon user's comprehension that Friendica and Hubzilla users don't notice it by default. So on the one hand, Mastodon users are increasingly stressed out by Friendica being Friendica and Hubzilla being Hubzilla. They ask themselves: "Why did they make everything so different from Mastodon? Why couldn't they have made it all just like Mastodon in the first place?" It's incomprehensible to them that Friendica and Hubzilla were both made before Mastodon. For how can something in the Fediverse possible pre-date Eugen Rochko's invention of the Fediverse? It's also incomprehensible to them that something in the Fediverse can be something else than a Twitter clone. Or they simply don't know how Facebook, which Friendica aims to be an alternative to, works differently from Twitter as well. On the other hand, Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) users are increasingly stressed out by Mastodon users trying to force Mastodon's culture upon them, along with Mastodon's limitations. Not few Mastodon users try to make Friendica, Hubzilla and (streams) behave more like Mastodon by putting pressure on their users to a) always do everything the Mastodon way and b) stop making use of features that Mastodon doesn't have. If you've never come across a Mastodon user complaining about a post or comment of yours being too long because you've exceeded the holy limit of 500 characters, then I'm very certain that you will. Food for thought: This entire conflict would disappear with a split. Mastodon users would be spared from utterly non-Mastodon things. And non-Mastodon uers would be spared from demands to stop making use of 90% of all features they have at hand just because Mastodon doesn't have them. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Fediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Fediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweet" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweet</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTweets" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTweets</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToot" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToot</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteToots" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteToots</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteBoosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteBoosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotedShares" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotedShares</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuotePostDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuotePostDebate</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=QuoteTootDebate" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">QuoteTootDebate</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://snug.moe/@lunareclipse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Lunawawa :neofox_snug: :therian:</a> <blockquote>vanilla mastodon is somehow the only software that doesn't allow admins to adjust the character limit.</blockquote> They can adjust the character limit. But it requires digging into the source code because the limit is hard-coded. Basically, if you as an admin want a higher character limit, you have to soft-fork Mastodon. And whenever you upgrade your instance to a new version, it's force-rebased to vanilla, and you have to soft-fork it and apply your changes again. Better yet: Changing the character limit by modifying the source code is, technically speaking, illegal. It would only be compliant with the GNU Affero General Public License if the admin uploaded the modified code to GitHub as a fork of vanilla Mastodon. But no Mastodon admin even only goes through the hassle of learning git just to have more characters. CC: @<a href="https://mastodon.uno/@talksina" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Elena Brescacin</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AGPL" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AGPL</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mindly.social/@floofpaldi" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Spooky Panda Bear 🌈</a> Quick and easy solution: Move away from Mastodon. Go someplace else in the Fediverse that doesn't have a 500-character limit. Move to Pleroma (5,000 characters, configurable by admin). Or Akkoma (5,000 characters, configurable by admin). Or Misskey (3,000 characters, hard-coded). Or one of the several Misskey forks (thousands of characters again, configurable by admin). Or Friendica (unlimited characters). Or Hubzilla (unlimited characters). Or (streams) (unlimited characters; that is, the database can handle a bit over 65,000 characters on older instances with no database upgrade and over 24,000,000 characters otherwise). All of them are in the Fediverse. The Fediverse is not only Mastodon. All of them are connected to Mastodon. Proof: This comment comes from Hubzilla. And then do something that nobody on Mastodon would even come up with the idea to do: Put the excerpt into the post. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=NotOnlyMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">NotOnlyMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseIsNotMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseIsNotMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=MastodonIsNotTheFediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">MastodonIsNotTheFediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Pleroma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Pleroma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Akkoma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Akkoma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Misskey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Misskey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkeys" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkeys</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Firefish" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Firefish</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Iceshrimp" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Iceshrimp</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Sharkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Sharkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Catodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Catodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescription" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescription</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptions" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptions</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a>

Jupiter RowlandDescribing images in thousands of characters each even when nobody needs them described; CW: long (over 2,200 characters), Fediverse meta, Fediverse beyond Mastodon meta, alt-text meta, image description meta, character limit meta

Jupiter RowlandNow let's assume I describe the image twice. Once in a long, detailed description that goes into the post instead of the alt-text (I don't have a 500-character limit; I don't have a limit at all). And then once again and purely visually in the alt-text because Mastodon users demand there be an image description in the alt-text. (3/9) #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescription" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescription</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptions" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptions</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://wandering.shop/@kagan" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Kagan MacTane (he/him)</a> Then I have a question. Warning ahead: This will be a little long. But I've cut it up in chunks of under 500 characters for your convenience because experience has shown me that many Mastodon users completely ignore anything over 500 characters. (1/9) #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescription" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescription</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptions" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptions</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://toot.io/@potungthul" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Potung Thul</a> <blockquote>If the idea is to work around limitations like not enough space for text, well, Mastodon is young enough that we should change the design specs rather than use it in an unintended way with unintended consequences.</blockquote> If you regularly run out of characters due to the 500-character limit, the solution that works best right now is not to wait for Mastodon to remove that limitation on all instances. Of course, it isn't to put excess characters into the alt-text either. It's rather to move to e.g. Akkoma or Iceshrimp or Sharkey or Friendica or so, anything in the Fediverse that offers way more characters on all instances so that you don't have to ask around which instance has more than 500 characters. CC: @<a href="https://mastodon.art/@foervraengd" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mirre :mastocheck:</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=NotOnlyMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">NotOnlyMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseIsNotMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseIsNotMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=MastodonIsNotTheFediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">MastodonIsNotTheFediverse</a>

Jupiter RowlandMastodon: 500 characters, Misskey: 3k characters, (streams): 65k or 24M characters; CW: long (over 1,600 characters), Fediverse meta, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta, quote-post

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://social.beaware.live/@BeAware" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">BeAware :veriweed:</a> <blockquote>but honestly a lot of it just goes over my head past a certain point.</blockquote> That's what I mean when I say I write about an extremely obscure niche topic, and I always have a lot to explain for people to get my images. Unfortunately, the whole topic is probably so special-interest that I have to shove too much down people's throats to give them even only the basics. They might not understand the images either way. <blockquote>But I do see your frustrations on things like post limits and alt text character limits and such.</blockquote> It isn't so much the technology. It doesn't make much of a difference whether Mastodon cuts my 40,000-character image description off at the 1,500-character mark, or whether Hubzilla lets me read only the first 3,500 characters because there's only so much vertical space in my browser window. The full description goes into the post text either way because it contains explanations that are necessary for people to understand the image, and people e.g. with a severe tremor who can't move a mouse steadily or with a head pointer that they poke around on a keyboard with can't read it when it's in the alt-text because they can't access alt-text. And when it's in the post text, Mastodon won't cut it off at the 500-character mark and throw the excess 39,500 characters away. If anything, it rejects posts with over 100,000 characters altogether AFAIK. I know that Pleroma and Akkoma reject posts over 50,000 characters, and I suspect Misskey and the Forkeys to reject even shorter posts. But nobody in my primary audience is on either of these. The problem is rather the culture. It's a culture that's cultivated on Mastodon and on Mastodon only, that disregards the rest of the Fediverse and how it's different because nobody knows, but that is being forced upon that self-same rest of the Fediverse regardless. If your home instance is connected to Mastodon, you play by Mastodon's unofficial rules or else. Sad, but true: The rules of one Mastodon instance don't apply to all connected Mastodon instances all the same. They apply to the local timeline, but not to the federated timeline. Other instances may have contradicting rules, and no instance admin is going to enforce rules that apply to other instances, but not their own one. At the same time, however, Mastodon's overarching unwritten cultural rules do apply to the federated timeline because they apply to all Mastodon instances. And they're forced upon everything that isn't Mastodon all the same. That's partly because Mastodon users don't even notice when something doesn't come from Mastodon, partly because some of those who do know that the Fediverse is more than Mastodon still believe that everything that isn't Mastodon is either an alternative UI for Mastodon with a couple extra features (Akkoma or Iceshrimp or Friendica is for the Web what Mona or Tusky is for the phone) or bolted onto Mastodon as an add-on otherwise, and it's partly because whoever is the biggest is the boss, and because Mastodon users tend to think Mastodon was there first. Mastodon's culture includes not only a sufficient description for each image you post, but you're expected to put the full description into the alt-text and only into the alt-text. This comes from adequately describing images in the post text being technically impossible on vanilla Mastodon with only 500 characters minus the actual post text, minus hashtags, minus mentions, minus even content warning. So for one, Mastodon users expect an image description in the alt-text. That's why I describe each image twice, once with a few hundred characters in the alt-text, once with thousands upon thousands of characters in the post text. Besides, I expect Mastodon users to be highly irritated when they discover that I've put a detailed image description into the post text rather than into the alt-text where they expect it. Yes, there's an image description in the alt-text. But why is there a longer one in the post text? Why isn't the long one in the alt-text where it belongs by Mastodon's standards? Why do I refuse to do things like they're done on Mastodon? Okay, so my full image description is too long for alt-text. But why don't I make it shorter then? Nobody on Mastodon writes image descriptions that are several thousand characters long. Why don't I write image descriptions like Mastodon users? Also: While Mastodon is fully capable of importing and displaying posts that are tens of thousands of characters long, many many Mastodon users are very opposed to posts longer than 500 characters. They're technically possible, but they're culturally disliked and frowned upon. This mostly applies to those who use the official Mastodon app that can't fold long posts in and expand them if you want to read them, but it isn't limited to those users. It's another cultural thing: Mastodon cannot post over 500 characters, so Mastodon users aren't used to over 500 characters, so nobody anywhere in the Fediverse must post over 500 characters. Mastodon users actually keep tooting that they want filters which remove everything over 500 characters from their timelines. And not exactly rarely, they take matters into their own hands. If they spot a post with over 500 characters in their personal timeline, they block the poster upon first strike, but not necessarily without complaining to the user first. Some go as far as doing that when they see a post with over 500 characters in the federated timeline. In fact, I expect entire Mastodon instances to have blocked non-Mastodon users instance-wide because some local user felt disturbed about their over-500-characters posts and asked the moderation to step in. There may even be instances, not even exactly small ones, that go as far as blocking the entire offending instance. For these reasons, for me, posting images while having connections all over Mastodon is like treading on raw eggs. I spend 13 hours describing an image in 40,000 characters just to give a casual bystander audience a chance to understand them. I post that thing. A few people may find it helpful. To many, it makes no difference in practice because they don't read my image description. And then there's the unknown number of Mastodon users who take countermeasures or have countermeasures taken by admins/mods because my gargantuan image post disturbs them and/or goes against Mastodon's culture. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltText" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltText</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=AltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">AltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWAltTextMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWAltTextMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescription" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescription</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptions" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptions</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=ImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">ImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWImageDescriptionMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWImageDescriptionMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Fediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Fediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=MastodonCulture" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">MastodonCulture</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a>

yianirisEnough with this twitter wannabe rules or 500 characters limit to posts That was a ridiculous rule by ridiculous social media that want to limit expressionYou can't express ANY idea in 500characters unless it is "common sense"It is ridiculous to hide behind tech excuses when you allow attachment of binaries to a short text message, bandwidth for the sake of bandwidthTEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT 500 lim<a href="https://libretooth.gr/tags/characterlimit" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#characterlimit</a> <a href="https://libretooth.gr/tags/characterlimits" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#characterlimits</a> <a href="https://libretooth.gr/tags/social" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#social</a> <a href="https://libretooth.gr/tags/mastodon" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#mastodon</a> <a href="https://libretooth.gr/tags/fediverse" class="mention hashtag" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">#fediverse</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://catodon.social/@panos" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Panos Damelos (Catodon) :catodon:</a> What's even worse is that just about everyone who joined the Fediverse in the last two years did so with the belief that the Fediverse is Mastodon, i.e. the Fediverse is nothing more than micro-blogging with a maximum of 500 characters. Many more still believe so than you may think. And I'm not talking about total newbies, but even about second-wave Twitter refugees who came here right after Musk had bought the birdsite. For others, the first encounter with an over-500-character post was not only completely unexpected, catching them entirely off-guard, but utterly shocking and disturbing. Now they want their nice, friendly, cosy, fluffy, comfy Fediverse back that's only vanilla Mastodon. A few actually want a total, absolute, Fediverse-wide ban on posts over 500 characters. Others are looking for technical means that block any and all posts with over 500 characters server-side, and I think they aren't limited to those still stuck on the official phone app that doesn't fold longer posts in because it was built not only against only Mastodon, but against Mastodon being the only Fediverse project. As long as they don't get that, they complain and mute or out-right block anyone from whom they spot a post with over 500 characters in their federated timeline. And I guess they're so numerous after all that this behaviour cuts deep into the range of everyone who isn't on vanilla Mastodon. This exactly is why I always add the hashtags #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a>, #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> and #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> to everything that goes out of here that exceeds 500 characters. Raw count in a text editor, not fancy Mastodon way of counting. And if it's a post as opposed to a comment, I also add a Mastodon-style CW like "CW: long (5,204 characters)" although Hubzilla a) doesn't have Mastodon-style CWs in the summary field as part of its culture and b) has something much better instead. Still, hardly anyone reads these posts. It really seems like the only way to get my posts significant exposure on Mastodon is by actually staying below 500. Considering the amount of hashtags I need for my posts to both be discoverable and trigger filters, and considering that I didn't come from 140/280 characters to 500 characters, but I'm used to not having a character limit, it's a struggle. I often end up giving up, exceeding 500 characters and pulling all long post warning stops because that's easier for me. It doesn't help that everyone who joins Mastodon believes that Eugen Rochko has invented the Fediverse. Bonus points for Rochko having invented both Mastodon and the Fediverse in 2022 as a reaction upon Musk's announcement to buy out Twitter. If they haven't heard of it any earlier, it probably hasn't existed any earlier. When they're wondering what kind of witchcraft you're pulling off with your impossibly long post, not to mention stuff like bold type or italics or a bullet-point list, and you've managed to get into their heads that you are, in fact, not on Mastodon, they still think that whatever you're on was bolted onto Mastodon by someone. Even if you manage to convince them that, no, what you're using is being developed entirely independently from Mastodon, they still think it was made after Mastodon. And they wonder why it deviates so much from Mastodon instead of mimicking it. Or why it exists at all if there's already Mastodon. However, this also means that they see everything in the Fediverse that isn't Mastodon as an intruder in Mastodon's Fediverse because, of course, Mastodon was here first. And everything that isn't Mastodon has to conform to Mastodon's unwritten rules and adopt Mastodon's culture. In fact, if something isn't Mastodon, it isn't allowed to have its own culture if that culture differs from Mastodon's. This also means that nothing that isn't Mastodon is allowed to make use of any features that Mastodon itself doesn't have because they disturb some Mastodonians. Of course, at this point, you could and actually should tell them the truth. Rochko did, in fact, not invent the Fediverse. Because when Mastodon was launched, the Fediverse had already existed for about eight years. Without Rochko's doing. When Mastodon was launched, it immediately connected itself to StatusNet, Friendica, Hubzilla and Pleroma. The last three of these are actually still around, still part of the Fediverse, and Mastodon is still connected to them. So, you should ask them, why do you think Friendica would accept to throw six years more worth of culture than Mastodon has and 80% of its features out of the window and start behaving like a Mastodon clone? If they don't block you on the spot for not unconditionally surrendering to the new Mastodon overlords, you could try to compare the pre-Mastodon Fediverse projects to Native Americans and Mastodon to white European colonists. Oh, and by the way: Before Mastodon, character limits in general were an exception rather than the standard, especially if Diaspora* is taken into account. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=NotOnlyMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">NotOnlyMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=MastodonIsNotTheFediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">MastodonIsNotTheFediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseIsNotMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseIsNotMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterCount" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterCount</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a>

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://mastodon.social/@gazeshift" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Gazeshift</a> You won't be able to get that on mastodon.social. Either you try to find a Mastodon instance that has a raised character limit. However, there's no list of Mastodon instances with character limits. Or you move to something that's part of the Fediverse, fully federated with Mastodon, but not Mastodon proper, such as: <ul><li><a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/What_is_Pleroma%3F" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Pleroma</a> (5,000 characters by default)</li><li><a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/What_is_Akkoma%3F" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Akkoma</a> (5,000 characters by default)</li><li><a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/What_is_Misskey%3F" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Misskey</a> (3,000 characters hard-coded, feels very Japanese)</li><li>forks of Misskey like <a href="https://joinsharkey.org/" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Sharkey</a> or <a href="https://iceshrimp.dev/iceshrimp/iceshrimp" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Iceshrimp</a> (thousands of characters by default)</li><li><a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/What_is_Friendica%3F" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> (unlimited characters, handles nothing like Mastodon)</li><li><a href="https://joinfediverse.wiki/What_is_Hubzilla%3F" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> (unlimited characters, handles absolutely nothing like Mastodon, doesn't work with Mastodon apps; this is where I am)</li><li><a href="https://codeberg.org/streams/streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">the Streams repository</a> (unlimited characters, handles absolutely nothing like Mastodon, doesn't work with Mastodon apps, public instances are few and hard to find)</li></ul> They're all guaranteed to always give you many many more characters than vanilla Mastodon plus stuff like quotes, quote-posts and text formatting on top. But you'll have to get used to a wholly different UI and UX. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPosts" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPosts</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=NotOnlyMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">NotOnlyMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=MastodonIsNotTheFediverse" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">MastodonIsNotTheFediverse</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseIsNotMastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseIsNotMastodon</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Pleroma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Pleroma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Akkoma" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Akkoma</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Misskey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Misskey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Forkeys" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Forkeys</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Sharkey" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Sharkey</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Iceshrimp" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Iceshrimp</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Friendica" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Friendica</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Hubzilla" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Hubzilla</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Streams" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Streams</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=%28streams%29" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">(streams)</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a>

Jupiter RowlandSurprisingly for many of you, there are indeed people on Mastodon who have a problem with long posts over 500 characters; CW: long post (over 900 characters, over 1,200 in Mastodon count), quote-post, 19 hashtags (including 13 to trigger filters), Fediverse meta, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta, character count meta, character limit meta, over-500-characters meta, sarcasm

Jupiter Rowland@<a class="" href="https://streams.phanisvara.com/channel/phani" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">phanisvara (streams)</a> Yes, but many Mastodon users can't stand to see posts with over 500 characters. Not only do they refuse to read "long" posts, but some actually block anyone who exceeds 500 characters in a post even only once. I'm pretty sure some ask their Mastodon instance admins to deal with such people. Have them blocked instance-wide. Have their whole Hubzilla hub blocked on that Mastodon instance. Or they try to use Mastodon's report feature to report that Hubzilla user to the admin of that Hubzilla hub, or they have their admin try and get into contact with the admin of that Hubzilla hub, just to have that Hubzilla user sanctioned for breaking some unwritten Mastodon etiquette by posting over 500 characters in one chunk. Of course, they fail in both cases. Hubzilla doesn't support Mastodon's report feature, and mentioning Hubzilla users, in this case the admin, in a public post won't work either. Verdict: That Hubzilla hub is unmoderated and therefore has to be blocked or even out-right Fediblocked. On the grounds of the assumption that Hubzilla works exactly like Mastodon. Which I'm trying to debunk with this series of posts. As at least one of my polls has revealed, there seems to be a not insignificant number of Mastodon users who demand posts with over 500 characters be banned absolutely everywhere in the Fediverse. Including in conversation between users on other projects, regardless of whether overly long posts from that conversation might leak into Mastodon or not. And, of course, there's the Mastodon police that try to urge non-Mastodon users to limit their posts to a maximum of 500 characters, regardless of whether they're aware that the user in question is on something else than Mastodon or not. They're fully convinced that Mastodon was here first, and all the other projects are intruders in Mastodon's Fediverse and have to follow Mastodon's rules. #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Long" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Long</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=LongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">LongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLong" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLong</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWLongPost" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWLongPost</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=FediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">FediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CWFediverseMeta" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CWFediverseMeta</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterCount" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterCount</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=500Characters" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">500Characters</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=Mastodon" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Mastodon</a>

Jupiter RowlandHubzilla's unlimited character count; CW: Fediverse meta, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta

Jupiter RowlandHubzilla delivery report revealed that Misskey and the Forkeys refuse to accept 26,000-character posts; CW: long (1,300 characters), Fediverse meta, non-Mastodon Fediverse meta, character limit meta

Jupiter Rowland@<a href="https://hachyderm.io/@leoncowle" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Leon Cowle</a> <blockquote>I would consider doing the same to have more than 500 chars in posts. 😂</blockquote> Then use something else that isn't Mastodon. Misskey: 3000 characters (hard-coded) The Forkeys: at least 3000 characters (default) Pleroma, Akkoma: 5000 characters (default) Friendica, Hubzilla, (streams): literally unlimited CC: @<a href="https://stefanbohacek.online/@stefan" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">Stefan Bohacek</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimit" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimit</a> #<a class="" href="https://hub.netzgemeinde.eu/search?tag=CharacterLimits" rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">CharacterLimits</a>

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